A Lifetime of Happiness: Movies, TV, and Video Games

Batman Returns (1992)

December 14, 2022 Steve Bennet-Martin, Stephen Martin-Bennet, Bridget McMullen Season 1 Episode 149
A Lifetime of Happiness: Movies, TV, and Video Games
Batman Returns (1992)
Show Notes Transcript

The Steves welcome back Bridget to discuss the 1992 Christmas"ish" classic, Batman Returns, along with what's making them happy in pop culture today!

What's Making Us Happy?

  • Handmaid's Tale (Hulu)
  • Married at First Sight (Hulu)
  • Wednesday (Netflix)

Movie Discussion

  • Names and numbers behind the scenes
  • Our first memories seeing the movies
  • Should we sympathize for Oswald Cobblepot?
  • Tim Burton's Gotham
  • Michelle Pfeifer as Catwoman- Meow or Meouch?
  • Is this movie campy?
  • Were the penguin pall bearers real or robotic? Let us know at happylifepod@gmail.com - please! 

Until next time, stay happy!

Ending- Any music or audio clips were borrowed from the original source material.

Support the show
Steve:

Hello, returning Happy's and new listeners. This is Steve

Stephen:

Bennett Martin. And this is Steven Martin Bennett, and welcome to a Lifetime

Steve:

of Happiness, the podcast. We're ready to take you on our journey through some of the movies, shows, and other bits of pop culture that are helping to keep us happy while hopefully bringing a smile to your face along the way.

Stephen:

And this December, we're celebrating the holidays ish. Ish

Steve:

indeed, as we cover movies that take place around the holidays but are not traditionally considered Christmas. Like

Stephen:

Batman returns, and it wouldn't be a Tim Burton or a Batman movie if we didn't have our very own Catwoman with us. Bridget McMullen. Welcome Bridget. Oh,

Bridget:

meow. Thank you for having me,

Steve:

Of course. It is so good to catch up with you as we talk about one of your favorite Batman movies. I understand, right?

Bridget:

Yeah. It is my favorite Batman movie. Of course. Mine too, too. And that's even, yeah, and of course I'm biased. It's Tim Burton, so, but it's my favorite. Hands down.

Stephen:

Agreed.

Steve:

Well, before we jump into the movie, what's been making you happy, Bridget?

Bridget:

Oh, well, this is so Apropo because I'm going to say Wednesday, the Netflix series that Tim Burton directed four of the episodes and his executive producer. I am obsessed with this series. I love it. Yeah,

Steve:

it was,

Stephen:

it's so good. Yeah,

Steve:

so

Bridget:

good. And, and I just wanna say what's interesting is this series is really crossing so many generation. I know it's gotten like the highest ratings of any Netflix series, but I'm just noticing it's really touching a lot of different generations. Like my parents who are in their seventies are enjoying the series. So I just think it's really exciting.

Stephen:

It's really, really good. And like as I said before, I think my favorite character in the show is Gwendolyn Christie's principal character. Oh, it's good. There's just something about her performance and things. There's so many layers and levels to it. of course, everyone is obsessed with the dance sequence in episode four.

Bridget:

And do you guys remember that I texted you the day that I watched that for the first time? Yeah. And I, that was immediately, I said, watch out. This scene is gonna be iconic. I knew in the moment I was watching it that this was gonna be huge. It just, ugh. It's so magical.

Stephen:

And you were absolutely right. Oh darling. What's been making you happy?

Steve:

Married at First Site, season 12. I know a while back I mentioned how I found married at First Site, season 11 on Netflix. It ends up, there's two more seasons on Hulu that I've been watching and it is a guilty pleasure for sure. It is messy reality show. Drama. It has probably the biggest villain I've ever seen in any show ever in Chris this season with Chris and Paige.

Stephen:

Like every time that I think that there is a reality show villain that can't top another villain like Paloma from the season of Big Brother was one of the biggest villains I had ever seen in her short one week time on the show. And then this guy Chris, comes along with real world consequences and is even worse. Yes.

Steve:

Ooh. So if you like a good villain, you'll be screaming at her. Like, just say no, walk away,

Stephen:

Well,

Bridget:

and Ooh, I'll have to check it

Stephen:

out. Definitely check it out. And for anybody that hasn't seen married at First Sight, so it is there's science behind what is happening here. Like the people that want to be involved are all taking these quizzes and interviews and tests and things, and you have. People that are using scientific reasoning to pair up potential mates. And then the people see each other for the first time at the altar. At the altar. Wow. Yeah.

Steve:

And it's an interesting concept and it certainly like even raises the stakes from another show. I binge Love is Blind where at least they have an engagement period after getting engaged without seeing each other. But th this one, it's just, it leads to some train wrecks. I can see how the, when the science works, it works really well. But I also feel like sometimes, especially when you get people in like their early to mid twenties somethings and they're asking like questions about love, they might be answering with more like what they feel they should be answering than what they truly feel.

Stephen:

Mm-hmm. And that's exactly kind of like whenever you're taking personality assessment things, you're like, oh, what does the assessor, what's the correct answer? That's not gonna make me look like a serial killer. Type of thing. Yeah. Speaking of

Steve:

killers, what has been making you happy? When I

Stephen:

love So I am finally catching up on Handmaid's Tale and I am finally up to season five, which is the most recent season. There's one more final season, season six coming up. And this is a show that we loved it when it first came out and then we took a break from it and I came back to it without you. And you're

Steve:

okay with that? I am okay with that. I say enjoyed in like the term of like, this is interesting, looking at a possible version of our future. But then, yeah, in terms of like the making me happy, it didn't really feel a happy

Stephen:

void. well, the, this portion of it spoiler alert for anybody that has not seen it cover your ears. We're finally getting to some retribution for some of the people that have been the worst. In the series. So that's been a little nice that there are consequences and accountability happening. Finally.

Steve:

Yes. Now getting back on the subject of Batman Returns, why is it your favorite Batman movie, Bridget? Oh,

Bridget:

well, I feel like, you know, the characters get like these new layers on them. I mean, we're, we're, we got that introduction to Michael Keaton as Batman and, you know, the first Batman. And I love the aesthetic of this film, but the characters, I feel like they're getting, you know, more layers to the, we're feeling like we connect to Gotham too, like all the characters in Gotham as well. It's darker. I, I, which I love. I feel like there's darkness. Like we're really starting to see the dark side of Batman in this. And and I do love that it takes place during the holidays, I think. I think the holidays, dare I say, has a level of darkness and sadness, so it ties right into Batman, which, you know, he has that underlying sadness, darkness to him. So I think it's kind of perfect.

Stephen:

And playing off of what you were saying with the darkness of Batman and Gotham, it's dark, but it's never depressing. Yes. And agreed. Like, and it kind of hit a more solemn dark note with the new, the Batman, where, you know, they both went to the darker

Steve:

side and I'm like, why would anyone wanna live in this

Stephen:

city? Right. But I would wanna live in Tim Burton's, Gotham City.

Bridget:

Agreed. Yeah, a hundred percent.

Stephen:

Yes. Yes. It's a lot easier to list the things that I don't love about the movie, which is nothing. But I agree with you that the performances and the aesthetics, there are so many quotable lines in the movie. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And I've never gone through and made a list of my top 10 favorite superhero movies or top five, but I know that this is in my list of top, I'm not sure where it fits, but this is the one Batman movie that I can watch on repeat and be very happy about.

Bridget:

Yeah, agreed. Agreed. The screenplay, I feel like the writing like you were just saying, some of the lines that come from, I mean, each character has like a very memorable line, but the writing I feel like is super strong with Batman Returns,

Stephen:

and you definitely see Bruce in all of his layers in Yes. Michael Keaton's performance. Totally.

Steve:

Totally. Yeah. And for those not familiar with the movie, or trying to remember when it came out or how long it's been, it is a 1992 American superhero film directed by Tim Burton and written by Daniel Waters, who we know from Heathers. It's based on the DC comics character, Batman acting as a sequel to 1980 Nines Batman. And Hon, honestly, I have a question for both of you because I mean, I know Batman's origin story from the million different versions of these movies and the comics and video games and all of that, but I don't remember specifically 1980 nines Batman, and it didn't seem like I missed anything significant jumping in on this one without seeing the first one. Was there stuff I might have

Stephen:

missed? So you, you really get to see, like he talks about Vicki Veil in this movie. Yeah. Right. And there's some interaction where. he kind of lets his guard down with Vicki, but I think he's more authentically himself with Selena in this movie. Mm-hmm. I don't know. I like, other than them establishing the universe and things, and as long as, you know, how Batman came to be and how important Alfred is to him, yeah. I think you can jump right into this movie. Cool.

Bridget:

Yeah. I totally agree with that. Yeah.

Steve:

Absolutely. Yeah. And for a movie that had anywhere between a 50 and 80 million budget, it had a box office of 266.8 million making Wow. 47.7 million in its first three days, which was a record at the time. Wow.

Stephen:

And it came out, even though it's set at Christmas. Yeah. It came out because back then, movies like this, That played to families and children and teenagers came out during the summer. Come out in the summer. Yeah. And so this came out in June, the night before I went to summer camp. I remember it because there, there was like half the boys at camp that had seen it the night before camp and half the boys that had not. And so there was the whole like, oh well we can't talk about the movie in front of you cuz you haven't seen it type of thing.

Bridget:

Yeah. Well I had just graduated from high school that year, And yeah. And I remember like, I think I went to the first showing and my sister and I, we went cuz we were just so anticipating this. And and it was a big deal if Michelle Pfeiffer, there was like so much media, the news about Michelle Pfeiffer being in this black suit, you know? Mm-hmm. tight suit. Mm-hmm. So it was like everybody was like so curious to see Michelle Pfeiffer in this role as well. She was like the talk of the town at the time.

Stephen:

Agreed. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And I think, and so speaking of the stars, in her, in it, we have Michael Keaton reprising, his role as Bruce Wayne Batman from the first one, Danny DeVito, stepping in as the penguin, which is an interesting take on this because at that time most people knew Danny DeVito only as a comedic actor, especially from the TV show, taxi and things. Yeah. Uh, Michelle Pfeiffer as Selena, Kyle Catwoman, Christopher Walken as Max Shrek. And this movie really elevated Christopher Walken. He was already famous for things, but this brought him to world renowned. Yeah. Oh yeah. And Michael go reprising his role as Alfred. Mm-hmm. Pat Henle again as James Gordon. and Michael Murphy as the mayor of Gotham City. Mm-hmm.

Bridget:

Yeah. Such an amazing cast. Which, you know, Tim Burton is always just on the money with his casting. Oh

Stephen:

yeah. And like we got to see Michael Keaton also as Beetlejuice in another Tim Burton movie. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And so, and Danny DeVito becomes especially in Big Fish, we get to see Yeah. Danny DeVito in one of my favorite roles of his

Steve:

mm-hmm. Yeah. And Oh yeah. Even with like the bit roles, like this movie starts off with us seeing the new parents Tucker and Esther Cobble Pott, who are played by Paul Rubins and Diane Salinger. Right. And that was so great. That was so great. Even I recognized him, I was like, babe, it's your

Stephen:

friend. Yes. So, because I do know Paul Rubins personally oh my goodness. And. I love that he is Daddy Cobble Pott and his PeeWee's big adventure co-star. Diane Salinger, who was Simone in PeeWee's big adventure. The lady that he met at the diner that always wanted to go to France is playing Mommy Cobble Pott. So I like, I have to assume that he was like, oh, I have somebody really good. Yeah. Or act, what am I thinking? Tim Burton directed PeeWee's big adventure. Yeah. Right. He knows Diane Salinger, so Yes. Right, right,

Bridget:

right. Yeah. And if I'm not mistaken, Danny DeVito and Michael Keaton then reunited in Dumbo. Right. Wasn't my, yeah. Those two were in Dumbo. Right. I have together

Stephen:

Sure. I, I wanna say, I have to admit that I have not seen Dumbo. Yeah. Because friends of ours that are huge Dumbo fans, said that the movie was really depressing and sad. So it is,

Bridget:

and well, Dumbo, in my opinion. I mean, even Disney, the cartoon movie, it originally was pretty sad. So the fact that they made cry, it's, it's a sad story. Yeah, exactly. But anyways, he's, he just, he, I love that he just has his tribe and he can see the range. You know, like when he's creating these characters, he knows like, oh, so-and-so would be great for this role. You know, he's not casting Johnny Depp in all his roles.

Stephen:

Yeah. No matter what people think That's

Steve:

right. That's right. Yes. And so it starts off with Tucker and Esther cobble pot, burdened with a deformed and violent infant son when snowy night, they dispose of him by tossing him concealed in a basket into a stream. The basket floats down through Gotham City, Gotham City Sewers, as the credits roll and eventually arrives at the underground Penguin habitat at the Gotham City Zoo, which has been out of business for some time.

Stephen:

A. Boo on the people that ran the Gotham City Zoo for just neglecting the penguins and allowing them to live on their own. Yes. That was bad. But also interesting that, so whenever we see Oswald killed the family cat, whenever he's being kept in the cage with the bars mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. there's a little rubber duck hanging off the front of it, which later we see how big ducks are to Oswald as an adult. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And so just that little touch that you can miss on the front of the cage plays such a big role later on. Yeah.

Steve:

Yeah. Now, are we supposed to feel bad for Penguin here? Yes.

Stephen:

Yeah. Yeah. But he, he ate the family cat, but he was also treated like an animal. Caged. Mm-hmm. up and ignored by his parents, and then they tossed him into the river, expecting him to drowned. and or starve to death or die of hypothermia. This child surviving is a testament to how strong of a person he will become, but mm-hmm. Yeah. We are supposed to feel bad for baby Oswald. Okay.

Steve:

I guess I'm just sick. Yeah. Now, 33 years later, Gotham's preparing for festivities around the Christmas season. Max Shrek the corrupt owner of a company whose factories emit a dangerous amount of toxic waste, is nonetheless a celebrated local figure. Head. Gotham's owns Santa Claus. Max wants to build a power plant, but the mayor says Gotham has a power surplus. Max threatens to recall the mayor if he doesn't get his way,

Stephen:

and there's a brief introduction of Meen. Mild and very unsure of herself. Selena Kyle. as Max's personal assistant, and I think it's important that we see these scenes of Michelle Pfeiffer early on. Mm-hmm. as a mirror image to what becomes later.

Steve:

Yeah. And especially since, I mean, I don't, I didn't know Michelle Pfeiffer as well back then when the movie came out and but like I saw her and I was like, even if I didn't know she was gonna be Catwoman, I'm like, that's no secretary. Like the Shell Pipe is not class into a movie to play the Mecca Mild Secretary without something happening to her. She just has that presence even when she's playing Meka mild of someone like who has that sort of strength to help take control of her room.

Stephen:

Because even though all three of the women in the witches of Eastwick are phenomenal, Michelle Pfeiffer is the one in that movie that really, I believe stuck out the most. Mm-hmm.

Steve:

Oh

Bridget:

yeah. Absolutely. Yeah,

Steve:

absolutely. Now Shrek joins the mayor at a city gathering to make a short speech, but a gang of grotesque and very Tim Burton esque circus performers descend upon the crowd. They attempt to kidnap Shrek, but the sudden arrival of Gotham's trusted hero, Batman sends him Curring away. Meanwhile, Batman saves Selena, Kyle from a clown. Initial thoughts on the opening.

Stephen:

I think it's an excellent opening. We're introduced to pretty much all of the characters in a very short amount of time. Mm-hmm. and you get a very clear sense of their motivations and personalities like this just from their dress, their hair. I mean, the way that they make Max Shrek look like a cartoony villain with his hair and his clothing, but that it seems so normal still in a Tim Burton world. Oh yeah. It's, yeah.

Steve:

Cuz you look at him and you're like, Shee. I wonder if he's a villain. Yeah.

Bridget:

That's so true. This, the opening just grabs your, commands your attention, really. So like, even if you weren't a Batman fan, I mean just like there's so much going on in that opening those opening scenes and then, you know, talking about it's, you know, Batman's or Burton's Gotham being timeless. It's so true. But that's like Burton's style. Is that like, when you're watching his films, you're like, what decade is this? Where could this be happening? It's like, so dare I say like multi-dimensional. It's like when is this really taking

Stephen:

place? Agreed. Like, as I said, it's once at once rooted in the thirties, forties, and fifties, but it's also modern cars. En clothes give a nod to yester year with a flare. That's definitely from today. Yeah. And it ages so well as a Batman movie because it can't be pigeonholed into a specific time because it's mix of technology and traditional, you can't say, well, that's definitely that time period because yeah, it doesn't really fit. And the, like, we see the Red Triangle Circus gang here, and it's very Tim Burton, especially the one that's wearing the giant skull mask with the floating eyes in it. Oh yeah, yeah, totally totally. Tim Burton and the Shrek department store giant cat head that with the eyes that spin around in the cat head that twirls. Like, you could just show me that. And I'd be like, that's a Tim Burton movie, right? Oh, totally. Yeah. And it

Steve:

also, the intro has one of the, the quotes that you love to say along with the movie with, with the first interaction between Selena and Batman.

Stephen:

Wow. The Batman Or is it just Batman? Your choice. Of course that was brief, just like all of the men in my life, And then she grabs the taser and she tasers the clown, and you can see that it scares her and excites her a little bit. And then she keeps the taser, which will come into play later in the movie.

Bridget:

Mm-hmm.

Steve:

Awesome. Yeah. Yeah. Now, soon afterward, the circus gang managers to capture Shrek when he is alone in a dark alley. They take him through the sewers to the layer of their leader, the mysterious penguin, who is a hideous cobble pot child now spending his adulthood in the abandoned zoo where his basket had landed so many years before. the Penguin attempts to blackmail Shrek by threatened to expose his underhanded business dealings, including toxic waste, shredded documents, and dead business partners. Hands. Hi

Stephen:

Max. It's me. Your old

Steve:

partner, having no knowledge of his past life or true identity. Penguin sees Shrek as a potential vehicle for a chance to live on the surface and be accepted by others. Thus giving him the freedom to track Dennis's family. Shrek reluctantly agrees to work with Penguin because what could possibly go wrong?

Stephen:

Now you have a fact here that I had no idea about.

Steve:

Yeah. Danny DeVito remained in character between all the takes, so he was constantly Wow.

Stephen:

Acting it like the penguin that had to be so creepy on set, like, oh, totally. Like I know that Meryl Streep stayed in character and Devil Wears Prada. Yeah, you can get used to that. Danny DeVito is terrifying as the penguin. Could you just imagine like

Steve:

talking to him at lunch while he's just like eating like a raw salmon? Oh, and just, yeah.

Bridget:

Yeah. And then like the fingers. How he, they have those scenes, like where he's always kinda like slobbering and like dripping like black stuff out of his mouth. Yeah. You know, like the, oh yeah. That would be so gross.

Steve:

Yes. And one thing I love about the little, the little penguins is that it was a mix of real life penguins as well as animatronics. But Stan Winston told a little story about how his crew were collecting the mechanical penguins after a day shoot and they found one of the live penguins snuggled up a asleep against a mechanical one. Oh

Bridget:

my gosh. That's so cute.

Stephen:

And you, you can definitely tell in the scenes if you are really, really paying attention which ones are real and which ones are mechanical. The

Steve:

Paul bearers at the end

Stephen:

weren't. I, no, I honestly thought those were the real ones. I thought those were the fake ones.

Steve:

Oh, I guess we don't

Bridget:

know. Okay. We, we have to go back and watch it again tonight and we need to hone in on the

penguins.

Steve:

Yep. Yes. So listeners let us know that you think that those were the real penguins or the fake ones

Stephen:

now the abandoned zoo. So they do this flyover of the whole zoo, and it has a very dark, magical winter wonderland. Very Tim Burton look to it. It's kind of like Halloween Town from Nightmare Before Christmas if it was covered in ice, is that kind of feel to me. Yeah. Yeah. And it, and again, just from that aesthetic sets up what you're expected to see below and it all fits together so well. Like there is no jarring difference between things. It all fits. Hmm.

Bridget:

Yes it does. Absolutely. Yeah. Perfectly.

Steve:

We then get to see Selena Kyle again, who is living in a lonely single person apartment with only her regular company of an alley cat who comes through a window every night for a saucer

Stephen:

of milk. So whenever she gets home and she goes, honey, I'm home. Oh, I forgot. I'm not married. I used to say that line, whenever I would get home from long days at work in Cincinnati, especially in the winter when it was already dark outside, and I'd flip on the lights as I came in the door and just be like, honey, I'm home. Oh, that's right. I'm not married.

Steve:

I was more able to also identify with the passive aggressive voicemails from her mother.

Stephen:

Oh yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. And her apartment is very mild pink. It's not a bright and happy pink. It's not a cheery pink. If a pink can be bland, that is her apartment and she's got stuffed animals everywhere. She has a neon sign that's cute and says hello there. It's very much not an adult's usual typical movie apartment. Yeah. Yeah, and as you said, the passive aggressive voicemails from her mom, her current boyfriend breaking up with her via answering machine message as well. Yeah. But she also

Steve:

gives zero fucks about that. Yeah.

Stephen:

Yeah. She, she doesn't seem to care. No. Yeah.

Steve:

Then she gets called into work in the office after hours where she accidentally stumbles across proof of Shreks crooked business schemes about power plants and how it actually would siphon power from Gotham so he could sell it back later. Shrek arrives and despite Selena posing no blackmailing threat, attempts to kill her by pushing her out the window, she falls several stories into an alley below, but a strangely resurrected when a swarm of stray cats. Including Miss Kitty surround her and begin licking on her and chewing on her in a day. She returns home, does a monotone, creepy version of her.

Stephen:

Honey, I'm home. Yeah. Oh, that's right. I'm not

Steve:

married. And then when she hears the name Shrek on the answering machine, she freaks out and thoroughly trashes her apartment. Changing the Hello there. Sign into hell here. Yes. I love it. Yes. Yes. Putting the stuffed animals down the garbage disposal, which just doesn't seem like the most efficient way to get rid of them. Nope. Black spray paint on the walls. She's destroying her dollhouse. She makes the skintight black catsuit from an old jacket and attaches metal claws to our fingertips, thus reinventing herself as Catwoman.

Stephen:

And then we have her first line where she says, I don't know about you Miss Kitty, but I'm feeling so much yummier,

Bridget:

And that was so amazing to hear Michelle Pfeiffer say that. Cuz now we're really seeing a different Michelle Pfeiffer we have not seen on screen before.

Stephen:

No, and and it is totally the opposite of the Selena Kyle we first saw when she's like, I have a question. It it, it's more of a comment really to now. Yeah. Very different.

Steve:

Yeah, exactly. Now I'm used to Selena, Kyle and other versions kind of being like naturally born with her cat like abilities or it's because she like lived a life on the street or mm-hmm. everything. And this is one of the more supernaturally types of versions I've seen of the way that she became Catwoman. What do you think of that transformation?

Stephen:

Honestly, I think this is more believable than orphan Girl on the streets ends up being really good at acrobatics and breaking. to think like, yeah, because the Catwoman is a cat burglar. Mm-hmm. in the DC comics. Mm-hmm. But this makes more sense that like she's more catlike because the cats bring her back. I don't know, I bought this totally hook line up. No, I bought it

Bridget:

too. Yeah. And just the fact of, you know, let's say without the cats, like, with all this kind of crap going on in her life, she, you're seeing her, you're kind of feeling this like heaviness from her. Like something was b had something had to give, like she's having a crappy day and you know, just her boyfriend breaking up, you know, that first scene with her going into the thing she lost. Lost it. Yeah. You know, and I feel like we all can relate to like when we're having you know, rough times in life, it leads to some type of transformation. So Yes, totally believable. And I love it.

Stephen:

And like the scene with she and Max is so tense.

Steve:

You know what Curiosity did to the cat?

Stephen:

I know Cat. Just an assistant secretary. A

Steve:

very good

Stephen:

one too. Good. Okay. Go ahead in. Intimidate me. Bully me if he makes you feel big. I mean, I mean, it's not like you can just kill me. Actually, it's a lot like that. Mm-hmm. And then he laughs, turns around and then pushes her. Like whenever they both laugh, you're like, oh, it was just a joke. Mm-hmm. And then he turns around real quick and pushes her. You don't see it coming because you had just let your guard down. Mm-hmm. Ugh.

Steve:

So powerful. Yep. And meanwhile, the penguin prepares to make his entrance into society. During a press conference, a circus gang member appears and snatches the mayor's infant son from his mother's arms. After the gang members disappeared down a manhole, The penguin rises to the surface holding the unharmed baby in a totally not staged rescue attempt. the setup turns the penguin into a local hero, and he wins the respect of the citizens and city officials alike.

Stephen:

I mean, obviously now you're a hero to the mayor. Mm-hmm. the, the people are like, he saved a baby. He may be grotesque, but he saved a baby. It's a baby wolfy. So would

Steve:

you be, would you be pro penguin at

Stephen:

this point? I mean, you'd be one of be, you'd wanna say, well, my goodness, this man. You have to stand up for the underdog. He saved a baby

Steve:

Okay. I don't know whether I'd instantly be like, that's good mare material.

Stephen:

Oh no, I didn't I didn't say mayor material. I say give him the opportunity to join society material. Yes,

Steve:

and that's what they do. Shrek still access Penguin's main advisor and grant some access to the hall of records to search for information about his birth parents. The penguin rifles through piles of birth certificates and composes a long list of names. He then ventures to a cemetery flanked by reporters and lays flowers on the grave of Tucker and Esther Cobble pod. He reveals that his birth name is Oswald. The Penguin becomes a new sensation and a respected celebrity. Of course, only Bruce Wayne is suspicious believing there are more to be believing. There's more to penguin's motives. Yeah. With the help of Mistrusted Butler, Alfred Bruce investigates the Penguin's background and discovers that he had once been a member of a freak show in the Red Triangle Circus Group. On several occasions at which the circus stopped for shows, children had mysteriously gone missing.

Stephen:

My guest is he ate them probably.

Steve:

Oh gosh. Yeah. Nema Wild Catwoman saves her first citizen

Stephen:

from a mu I am Catwoman. Hear me roar. Ugh,

Steve:

classic. Yeah. I thought it was interesting to hear in this backstory though, that cobble pot left the sewers at some point. Did a roundabout as like a performer, and I, I just assumed at first until this part that he had been living in the sewers his entire life. Well,

Stephen:

so I would say that, I don't know if the circus found him or he found the circus, cuz I guess there's, you know, arguments to be made on both sides. But when a lot of the circuses, except for, you know, There used to be w Ringling Brothers and Barnum and Bailey. Mm-hmm. And then when there was only room for one because they weren't making enough money, they joined together and now there's none. Yeah, like smaller circuses, like the red triangle would've just gone out of business. And I'm guessing at that point Ingham was like, I know where we can go.

Steve:

There you go. Mm-hmm. no. Taking the Penguin's respectability a step further. Shrek plans to have the current mayor impeached and recalled and replaced with Oswald Cobble pot. Though the penguin does not take kindly to image consultants, he relishes his rise to power. The Circus gang uses setups to convince the public that the current mayor is unfit for office, resulting in even more support for the. and I, I wish the idea of Penguin becoming mayor seemed outlandish, but in today's political climate since then, who knows?

Stephen:

Yeah. I mean, and it's not the first storyline of Penguin running for mayor. Yeah. Because in the original sixties Batman Yeah. Show Penguin was running for

mayor.

Steve:

Yeah. And he had in some of the games as well and things. So yeah. This is just one version that I don't see being very merely

Stephen:

No. And because in the original he's well groomed. Yeah. And looks respectable. He just runs a criminal organization. And this one, you know

Steve:

it, but who would you vote, who would you vote for? Penguin or. Oh gosh, penguin. Really?

Bridget:

Oh, do you have Penguin Sorry. Even if he does fight, he, yeah, I gotta go with Penguin.

Stephen:

Now, you had made a comment that you felt that Batman was taking a backseat during the first act of the movie. I

Steve:

did. And I mean, maybe it's because we like spent an entire movie beforehand getting to know him better, that it was okay. But this, it just seems like other than like him showing up to save the Day from the clowns at the beginning like that, it really is working more on building up the other characters, the Penguin Shrek Catwoman.

Stephen:

So what you didn't really see in the first Batman movie was Jack Nicholson got equal billing as the Joker, and they spent a good amount of time with his Napier character really getting you introduced to them. So And I think that you almost have to give enough time to the villains so that you care Yeah. About the consequences and the fights that are gonna be coming. You almost know Batman and especially in the sequel. I don't know, what do you think? Bridge. Yeah, no,

Bridget:

that's a great observation actually. And then I was just gonna kind of say and you know, and maybe it is because it's like assuming you're, you already are aware of Batman's background and who he is, you know, and. What he's doing. But the scenes that Michael Keaton does have, I feel like he's so great and like, you know, he, his presence, like he, each scene that he does is commanding your presence. He, he's making his mark in the film. But I agree with you. I think the villains play a huge role in all Batman films and and in the series to where it's like, so that you do care when, like, you, it's kinda like you're part of Batman's team, like you're wanting to go after these guys and stuff. So that's a great

Stephen:

observation. Now, we, you had spoken about the image consultants and the image consultant was talking about penguin's, lack of hygiene and how there's not many reflective services down on the sewer. And Penguin laughs and they all laugh. And Penwood goes, it could be worse. My nose could be gushing blood. And they all laugh. And the guy goes, I don't get it. And then Penguin bites his nose and it gushes blood. And you realize that, you know, you may be able to try to make him mayor and put some nice clothes on him, but he's a wild animal. Yes. He's gonna be feral no matter what.

Steve:

Right. I struggle The second that you compared him outside of his trench coat to Silky. And I just can't

Stephen:

So there's, there's a drag queen on RuPaul's Drag waist named Silky Nutmeg Ganache. And I, it's started

Steve:

as a villain. I like her now.

Stephen:

I, I, I like her more now, but and she's a bigger girl and we are full fans of full figured bigger girl drag queens. Absolutely. But there's. She wears these outfits that are not flattering for her body type. And you know what Penguin looks like without his jacket on? Like when he is climbing up those circular stairs to his attic? Yeah. That's what Silky looks like in some of her outfits. Oh, okay.

Steve:

And,

Stephen:

and I just kept on seeing that I couldn't. Yeah. So we, we watched Silky Friday night on drag Race Canada versus the world, and then we watched the movie again yesterday and I said, babe, doesn't he look like silky I know. And

Steve:

now you can't. I He can't unsee it. No, I can't Oh my gosh. That's great. Now we finally get Bruce Wayne and Selena Kyle meeting in their usual identities during a meeting with Shrek. There's a mutual attraction, but neither expects the other of leading a double. Nor should they, I don't think that's an initial thing where you meet somebody, you're like, I

Stephen:

wait a minute. Are you a superhero?

Steve:

Yeah. At night, as their alter egos, they encounter each other. After Catwoman blows up a Shrek department store, they eventually have a violent fight ending in Catwoman being thrown off a tall building into a truck full of kitty litter.

Stephen:

Now Michelle did her own whip work in the movie, and so that scene in the Shrek department store with the mannequin heads, she did that all in one take and it was Wow. Really impressive. There's a great behind the scenes video you can find where when she does it all in one take the in at like, whenever the yell cut, the whole crew just starts applauding loudly of how impressed they were with her. Yeah. Cause wow. I,

Steve:

I thought that that was like special effects or something.

Stephen:

Nope. She did that all herself. It was really cool.

Steve:

Nice. Now. That's so awesome. Do you buy their chemistry here? Yes.

Stephen:

And oh my gosh. Yeah. I, I think they can also recognize the darkness in the other person. But the, the line that's kind of funny to me is when Shrek goes, this is my assistant, Selena, Kyle, and Bruce goes, we've met, have we? Sorry, I mistook me for someone else, which is a funny line because it's, I mistook you, you, but he said, I mistook me. It's a nod to him also being Batman. But what it also says that of all the people in Gotham that he saved, he remembers Selena and she made an impression on him. Yes.

Steve:

And then later on when they're in their alter, he goes, there's also the dialogue

Stephen:

of Life's a bitch now. So am I. Yeah. And when she's playing with him and who is the man behind the bat, maybe you can help me find the woman behind the cat. it really shows the two sides of Selena that are fighting for control and I get their chemistry so much why nobody has ever put them back in a movie as leads together. I'll never understand. Oh,

Bridget:

agreed. Greed. And I mean, not to jump ahead, but this particular film, and I'm sure we'll talk about this later, clearly, Burton, if he wanted to ever jump back in on this particular to, to pick up, I mean, not that he loves to do sequels, but he could easily pick up the storyline

Stephen:

from this. Oh, for sure. Yeah. If we did a Batman 30 years after this and like Yeah, we could easily, the worst thing that happened to the original Batman Quad Trilogy. is Tim Burton leaving? Mm-hmm. Yeah, absolutely. Because then it became, became cartoony. Yes. Which is fine, but when you have such a wonderful tone to the first two that they like, were nominated, the first one nominated for so many awards, and then the tone really shifts for number three and four. And I mean, yeah. That's the reason why they stopped after four. Yeah. Yeah.

Steve:

Now, Selena, as Catwoman meets with the Penguin in an attempt to use political power to get revenge on Batman, the Penguin agrees clearly a harboring intense, less lust for Catwoman, and they concoct to plan to frame Batman as a villain and turn all of Gotham against. Now, funny story in the scene Michelle Pfeiffer had to put a live bird in her mouth. They had bird P puppets on set, but Pfeiffer thought they all looked too fake. So she actually had the bird in her mouth when she spit it out. Oh my

Stephen:

gosh. I had no idea until she, me neither. She put that in the, and I was like, I have so much, like I already respect her so much as an actress. Now even more so, could you imagine like this bird is in your mouth. Are you afraid it's gonna be pecking at your jaw or your gums or scratching you and things like, and so now I wonder when they do that thing and she opens her mouth and it flies out, is that the actual bird? Yeah. Like, oh yeah. Yeah. Oh. Now the other fun thing about this scene so downstairs in the campaign office, the beautiful staffer says, you are the coolest role model A young person can have. And Penguin says, well, you're the coolest young person a role model can have. And then he gros her. What I think is really interesting is that staffer as world renowned award-winning journalist, Lisa Guerrero, and she says that after all of the hard-hitting stories that she's broken over the last 30 years, she goes, I'm always remembered for that one scene. Oh my God. And Batman

Steve:

returns. Wow. The plan unfolds on the night of a ceremonial relighting of the Christmas tree and Gotham Square, a beauty queen, known as the Ice Princess, is in her dressing room preparing for her duty of pushing the button to light the tree. Big responsibility

Stephen:

because she, and she's not sure. She says The lights come on, and then I push the button. Wait. No, no, no. That's not right. Like She's not the smartest girl. It's very hard work.

Steve:

Yes. Now the penguin confronts her posing as a talent scout before entering her with a batang that the dog woman had stolen from Batwoman earlier. Kidnapping her,

Stephen:

It's an important scene. Sets things up, but not a lot to talk about.

Steve:

Yes, right. Bruce Wayne meanwhile had invited sing the Kyle to his mansion for dinner that evening. Their romance and tests intensifies but when they see the news of the ice princess being kidnapped on tv, they hastily make excuses to

Stephen:

leave. Now they, it's really cute that both of them want to be honest. Like they're both talking to Alfred and they both wanna be like, make sure you know it's not her. Make sure she knows it's not him. There's a lot going on, there's a lot going on, blah, blah, blah. Yeah. It's really cute how much they honestly feel for each other, but they don't wanna be too honest because they don't want to scare the other person. Yeah. But when they're flirting and celina's like, You know, it's the so-called normal guys that let you down. Sickos never scare me. At least they're committed and I think it's her darkness that calls to his darkness. And he's actually starting to feel like he can let down some walls and be his full self around her. Oh yeah,

Bridget:

he's definitely met his match. He has met the perfect counterpart for him. Really? And I love it. I

Stephen:

love that scene. I do too.

Steve:

Yes. And now, Batman Hunts for the Missing Woman finds her alive and bound in a tall building overlooking the town square before he can release her. Catwoman appears in, drags the girl to the edge of the building. The penguin out of sight says Rats with wings, do your things. Releasing several bats that fly frantically around the girls' head, causing her to lose balance and fall while giving the impression that Batman visible to the crowd below had pushed her. She lands on the tree switch, lighting it up and unleashing a flurry of bats that the penguin had hidden with in the

Stephen:

branches. Now Batman and Catwoman meet up again and end up, you know, under the missile toe. And we have the famous line of missile toe can be deadly if you eat it, but a kiss can be even deadly. Or if you mean it, yes. Ugh. And that it just, and again, that we get to play with it again later. Like even if we had never heard it again. It's so iconic right there. But then the how it comes into play later is just so much more powerful.

Steve:

Oh, totally. Yeah. Now, Batman attempts to flee in his famous bat mobile, but the penguin had placed a control vice under the car that lets him steer it from an arcade style car hidden in a trailer. Batman, helpless is trapped behind the wheel of the bat, mobile as of veers through the streets, knocking over city property, crashing cars, and frightening citizen. Batman manages to remove the control device before anyone is killed and returns home. But the damage is done. Gotham is turned against him. Yep. Do you think people would turn on the

Stephen:

Batman that easily? Yes. Because the only thing America loves more than putting someone on a pedestal is knocking them off of it and watching them follow.

Bridget:

Yep. Agreed. And I feel like Gotham has already, they're in that love hate with Bruce Wayne. What? And Batman. Mm-hmm. I mean, I mean, they're always at, at it, you know, like one week they're loving'em the next week, but they're that way with their whole city, if you think about it.

Stephen:

Oh yeah. That, that's definitely the love hate city. Like you gotta love Gotham to live there, but damn, it's a pile of trash type of feeling.

Steve:

Right, right now though, satisfied with the selling of Batman's reputation. Catwoman becomes an enemy of penguins by review. Refusing his gross sexual advances. He hooks her on one of the many trick umbrellas he has, which becomes a propeller that hoist her above the city and drops her through a greenhouse roof. She survives death yet again as she acquired nine lives upon her transformation.

Stephen:

Now, I love the line with cat, one of the penguins. She's like, you said you were going to scare the princess. She looked pretty scared to me.

Steve:

Yes. Now, do you feel that these are actually deaths that she's going through, or is it like domino from X-men bending luck around you nine times kind of thing?

Stephen:

Hmm. So I think that they are kind of D like, I'm not so sure about landing in sand. Yeah. But this one, she fell a long way, broke through the glass of the greenhouse, and then landed on a hard surface. Mm-hmm. if that didn't kill her after she screamed and all the glass broke, I think it would've sliced her to shreds. Like, what happened to Julianne Moore in the hand that rocks the cradle? Yeah. Okay, so I, I'll take you. I kind of feel like this one and then the gunshots later. Yeah, those are, well, I, I think that's stretching it a little bit cuz one of those was in her leg. Yeah. Yeah. So, but I'm going to suspension of disbelief and go with the story.

Steve:

Sounds good. Mm-hmm. Now, the next day, the penguin holds a press conference to su deriding the mayor for not providing a sufficient protection against the allegedly dangerous Batman. Bruce Wayne and Alfred, however, undo the penguin Sterling reputation by playing through lens speakers. A recording of a recent anti Gotham rant, the penguin had delivered to Batman. Just

Stephen:

relax, I'll take care of the squealing wretched pinhead puppets of Gotham. You gotta admit, I played this stinking city

Steve:

like harp from hell. Yeah. The crown turns on the penguin and he escapes to the sewers once more.

Stephen:

Now I love that he is battered with produce lettuce, tomatoes, eggs, And he even makes a comment that someone always brings produce to a public speech. And you see Penguin turn towards Max being like, Hey, huh. And Max is like, sorry, you're dead weight to me. Now you, there's I can you, you're no use to me anymore. And you know, dashes off on his own. Yeah. So it, it was a very fast downfall for him as well. Yeah.

Steve:

Now Furious. The penguin announces and he ties to humanity and reveals to his gang is true reason for visiting the hall of Records to collect the names of all the wealthy first Bun born sons of Gotham City, which the gang will then kidnap and murder while their parents are away at Max Shreks elaborate Christmas party. The Penguin seizes this revenge against his own parents for discarding their own firstborn in such a callous way. And his main target is Shreks grown sonship. You wouldn't

Stephen:

put me on a pedestal, so I'll put him on a slab.

Steve:

Yes. Chip, who seems to be doing his best, Christopher Walken impression, the entire

Stephen:

movie Oh yeah. And oh like, and you can also kind of see like, I hate to bring up the big orange dummy, but there's also some very like Trump-like tendencies in Max Shrek and Trump Jr. In Chip. Yeah. Like you can totally like, and I know this was before he All that. Yeah. All that came and so now I wonder, is this what they watch as like training videos in their family? Like this is what we're trying to achieve. Kids That, that's so

Bridget:

funny. Oh my gosh. I love.

Steve:

Oh, that's

Stephen:

so funny.

Bridget:

Oh my God, that's fantastic.

Steve:

Oh, shoot. Yes. Now Bruce and Selena attend the Christmas party. Bruce says he came to see her, but she says she came to see Max to kill him. Brilliant performance where you can see she's at the end of a rope edge of insanity,

Stephen:

and he calms her in. While they're dancing, they say each other's missile toe line because sh they're dancing and she looks up and she says the, you know, missile toe can be deadly if you eat it. And instinctively Bruce says, but a kiss can be even deadlier if you mean it. And they immediate really immediately realize who the other person is. And she has this frantic look on her face and she goes, oh my God, are we supposed to start fighting now? And he's like, let's go outside and talk and like this, because. You know that they honestly care for each other. Yeah. And then she's like, wait a minute, we're all supposed to, we're supposed to hate each other too. Yeah. And like you're like, no girl. It can be okay. You guys can be together. Yes. But

Steve:

before they can leave together, listen, the penguin appears and announces to all in attendance that their children are being kidnapped as he speaks and chastises them for leaving them unguarded so their parents could dress up like

Stephen:

jerks, get juiced and dance badly.

Steve:

Yes. He attempts to kidnap chip Shrek, but Max offers himself in his son's place realizing that his real beef is with Max, the Penguin agrees. And the two returned to the underground

Stephen:

lair. Now Bridge. What did you think of the Bruce and Salina scene? Okay,

Bridget:

well first of all, thank you for going back there because that is my favorite scene in the whole film. That moment that they realize who each other is. and then like she leans back, she's crying, but he leans into her, he moves forward and it's like, oh my gosh, where have you been my whole life? Like, he's like, there's almost like this relief, like I've met my match. Like I love this woman. You know? And I love that scene so much because he's not going anywhere. He's like even more drawn because he finally has met somebody that understands his darkness, you know? And but they're also trying to find justice in their city in like really bizarre, you know, crazy ways. So I love this scene.

Steve:

Yeah, and I think the

Bridget:

music, everything about this with it's face-to-face with Susie and the Banes, it's just it's one of my favorite scenes. It's such a great scene

Stephen:

and he's wanting to go outside so they can talk, and I'm sure he wants to talk her down and say, look, we, you don't have to go down this path. Yeah. And while that is valid, he doesn't really understand her experience and what she's feeling. And so it'll be longer than one conversation, even if they had gotten to have it like mm-hmm. Because there's some things that have to happen. And I think, you know, even once, he might have been more in line to help her with certain things. Once she's like, look, Shrek tried to kill me and look what he's going to do to the city. Mm-hmm. like, and Yeah. And he knew at that point that Shrek knew what kind of person Penguin was and what he was helping Penguin do. I think things could have been fixed, but they didn't get the chance. Yeah. And also interesting in this scene, so Penguin comes back up. And he has changed out of his fancier clothes back into his old dirty fur coat and everything. Mm-hmm. which I think that that's without saying so a complete rejection on everything Gotham had given him up to that point for sure.

Steve:

Oh yeah. Now Batman Springs into action attempting to stop the Penguins plan. The Red Triangle Gang is collecting the children in an actual circus train.

Stephen:

It was really cute. Like the circus train car thing that they had was very reminiscent of the, like the circus train that you see on the front of animal crackers, cookie boxes. Yeah.

Steve:

Now, bat Batman saves the kids and sends Penguin a note saying The children regret they cannot attend the Penguin resorts. To his backup idea of equipping his army of penguins with missiles and mind controlling devices, sending them into the streets to punish all of Gotham's children. Would've killed a hundred thousand people in the most funny, campy way possible. Could you imagine being murdered by a mind controlled penguin and their

Stephen:

missiles? Oh my gosh. And you, I like you wrote so campy, but awesome. And I'm thinking it makes sense to me. Like I, I guess I'm so like into the movie at that point. I now thinking about it, I'm like, oh, mind controlling the penguins. Yes. That, that, that's a little much putting missiles on the back on their backs. I see that. Okay, sure. I, but I, you know, it wasn't until we were watching, I was like, wait a minute. How did they convince them? Like to all converge in Gotham Square? Yes.

Steve:

Now Batman manages to direct the suicide bomber penguins back to the zoo layer to destroy the penguin rather than the city at this point. The Red Triangle gang abandons Penguin, and he's on his own. Batman confronts the irate penguin who attempts to attack him with a sword umbrella, but falls into the toxic sludge below.

Stephen:

Now, first time watching this, I was like, that fight was over really fast. Like I, because you think that this is the climax battle and mm-hmm. Wow. That was done really fast. And, but then also in my mind, I'm like, well, what's happening with Shrek? He's been trying to convince that mucky to give him the key so we can get out. Yeah, yeah. And Shrek attempts to escape the layer, but is intercepted by Catwoman bent on revenge to her abusive former boss, Batman attempts to convince her to let Max live and to be sent to prison. And, you know, Batman's like, you know, we're the same split right down the middle. We can turn him in and we can go home together. Yes.

Steve:

And what would you do in Salina's Place? Turn on Trek, or get revenge, Bridget.

Bridget:

I would wanna go home with Batman. So I would be like, of course you, I'd be like, okay, let's, let's, let's just, yeah, you're right. Ruth or Batman. Let's, let's, I wanna just go home with you.

Stephen:

So I mean, that, that would be what the sane person would do, right? Right. I just think she is too broken at this point.

Bridget:

You're right. You're right. She's not having that.

Stephen:

Mm-hmm. now Max shoots Batman and Selena thinking that Bruce is dead, loses it even more. And so Max starts shooting her several times, taking away more of her lives, and she starts her little rhyme with a poor five. Still alive. Six, seven. All good girls go to heaven. Well, two lives left. I'll save one for next Christmas. And then she electrocutes him with a live power line, a taser and a kiss, and there's a giant electrical explosion. And whenever Bruce goes to look through the wreckage, there's no Selena, but there's a very Tim Burton esque corpse of Max Shrek down below that looks kind of like large Marge if she were electrocuted, Mm-hmm.

Steve:

Yep. Now the pen, when it emerges from the water, fatally hurt from the toxins he ingested while submerged. Before he can pick up his deadly umbrella and killed Batman, he accidentally picks the cute one with toys on it, saying, damn, I

Stephen:

picked the

Steve:

cute one and falls dead at the edge of the toxic water below his. Six penguins that are probably fake, I think could be

Stephen:

real.

Steve:

Drag the body into the water, creating a grizzly funeral scene.

Stephen:

So the reason I think that they are real is they don't actually touch his body. Yeah. So I'm like, it's more of them just walking next to it and somehow they had the body slide down because the fins and everything, while they want you to look like they're dragging him, I don't think the fins actually touch the body. The scene is really powerful. Yeah. Because there's no way for Bruce to defend himself and the only thing that saves him is that he picked the cute one. Yes.

Steve:

Luckily he picked

Stephen:

the cute one. If he had picked the gun one, Bruce would've been dead, possibly. And to have the penguins. obviously showing how much Oswald had meant to them. Yeah. That they acted as Paul bearers. That scene always, I just, it's deep. It is deep.

Bridget:

It is deep. And you know, when you're first, I remember the first time I saw that you weren't expecting that type of emotion. Mm-hmm. at the end of this film, but it is

Stephen:

emotional. It does is

Steve:

yes. Yeah. It is deep. And then sometime later, Bruce is being driven home. In his limo by Alfred, he sees what appears to be Catwoman shadow playing across an alley wall. After leaving the car to investigate, Bruce only finds Miss Kitty returning to the car with the cat. Both Butler and Master wish each other a merry Christmas

Stephen:

goodwill towards men and and

Steve:

women. Yet the bat signal appears overhead and Catwoman appears proof that Selena still has one remaining life.

Stephen:

This made me so happy. Ugh.

Bridget:

Me too. Okay. Tim Burton needs to go to Netflix and let's pick up where this leaves off. Michael Keen, Michelle Pfeiffer, 30 years later, let's go. Come on. I want it.

Stephen:

Hey. That like, because Michelle Pfeiffer and Michael Keaton are still acting, they're both actually doing Marvel things right now. Yeah. So no reason that DC couldn't say, Hey, you guys wanna pick up and do it sort of like a there was a cartoon in the nineties called Batman Beyond. Yeah. Where 60 year old Batman, who was no longer able to fight crime on his own, has a new young apprentice in the Batman suit, have a 60 year old cat woman. And this brings them back together. Oh, I would watch it.

Bridget:

I would watch it. And I think so many people would. Yep. Yes. But we would, they need to get on this though. They need to get going. Yes. So we, Tim Burton's in his seventies, so we need to get this r rocking and

Stephen:

rolling right now. Oh, I didn't realize. Yeah. Tim Burton's 70. Oh. Mm-hmm. Final thoughts, my darling. I

Steve:

think it's good. I can see how it's a Christmas movie, but not a Christmas movie. And they say Merry Christmas. They do say Merry Christmas And so I, I'm excited to hear what our listeners

Stephen:

think of it. I love this movie, like even watching it again with a more critical eye for this. I didn't find anything. I mean, obviously you had issues with the remote control death penguins at the end. Oh no, I didn't have issues

Steve:

with it. I thought it was hysterical. there were no issues with it. I just was like, okay, we're doing this. Sure.

Stephen:

But I like it definitely holds up so well from 1992. This is 30 years later. Yeah. Yeah. And I think it is still brilliant. Their performances are hard to match in any superhero movie. Yeah. Obviously. Absolutely. Like as much as I love my Catwoman from dark Knight Rises mm-hmm. because I think that she's an amazing actress. Like Anne Hathaway is phenomenal. Mm-hmm. this Catwoman will always be the pinnacle Catwoman. Yeah. and Halle Berry's Catwoman is at the bottom, like number seven, like below all of the sixties. Catwoman

Bridget:

Yeah. And you know what's interesting is each Catwoman brings something different to the table, but I just feel that Michelle Pfeiffer just, oh gosh. There's just, there's something about hers that is relatable on like a lot of levels and, and I think it's because we're also seeing that transformation of her, like you had brought up Stephen, we're seeing the whole, her becoming of Catwoman that I just feel more connected to her

Stephen:

as Catwoman. So there's this great meme that I love from Arrested Development, which is one of my favorite sitcoms of all time. Lucille Bluth is the mother of a wealthy family. She's very detached from all of reality. and mm-hmm. There's a meme that people use whenever a woman does something that society might say, that's too far and it has Lucille. And it says, good for her. And I think the whole scene of her electrocuting Shrek, yeah. There you're like, mm-hmm. good for her. Yeah. Yep.

Bridget:

Yeah. I love that. Yep. Absolutely.

Stephen:

Do you know what else I love my darling? Me You. Remy. Remy, Bridget, Bridget. And our listeners. And our listeners. Yes. So

Steve:

we'd love to hear your thoughts on the episode. You can always email us at happy life pod gmail.com.

Stephen:

You can get in touch with us on all the socials, whether that is Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, or TikTok at Happy Life Pod.

Steve:

And until next time, everybody stay happy.